If wow matrix updates my mods i don't really care if the dev doesn't take the steps to protect their content. We are talking about free mods that require 3rd party sites to get their name out there. If the devs are really that pissed that wowmatrix is profiting off them why don't the devs sell the mods themselves and stop making it for free?
If wow matrix updates my mods i don't really care if the dev doesn't take the steps to protect their content. We are talking about free mods that require 3rd party sites to get their name out there. If the devs are really that pissed that wowmatrix is profiting off them why don't the devs sell the mods themselves and stop making it for free?
I'm sincerely wondering what reality you're from.
The UI sites host the addons, and give the authors the tools required to update them and interact with their users on bug reports. WoWMatrix strips the authors of these abilities, and in fact completely hides the fact that there ARE authors at all. Beyond that, instead of downloading the addon and hosting it themselves, whenever a WoWMatrix user updates their addons, the client pulls directly from the host site - stealing that site's bandwidth and costing them money.
Also: It's rather hard to sell open-source code since it's OPEN. What you sell is support, or accept donations. Otherwise you obfuscate the code making it hard (but not impossible) to read and duplicate.
It sounds to me like you don't give two shits about the hours on end the authors put into their work. You just want it handed to you and you want it to work and if it doesn't, fuck everyone. Please, go away.
It sounds to me like you don't give two shits about the hours on end the authors put into their work. You just want it handed to you and you want it to work and if it doesn't, fuck everyone. Please, go away.
This.
I hope you don't use any of my mods, and if you do, I ask that you stop using them. My addons might be free to use, but they did cost me time and effort to think of, write, debug and publish to some site that wowmatrix scraped for their data. I would hope that users would appreciate that and not use sleazy tools like wowmatrix.
Let's not forget the fact, that authors should have the fraking right to actually be able to choose where they want their addons hosted and if possible control their distribution. WoWMatrix is distributing addons without even asking or informing the authors, much less giving them credit for their work.
& as a reminder @ authors, you can write into wowmatrix and have your addons removed from the listing. only takes about 2 emails. I figure this is a more productive way of killing this service off.
The problem with matrix is that their updater actuallt works like most of us wants the CC to work. Its just an updater, and lists what you actually have, and what you can get.
Wish CC would be able to simplify itself down to this, and people might start using it...
The problem with matrix is that their updater actuallt works like most of us wants the CC to work. Its just an updater, and lists what you actually have, and what you can get.
Wish CC would be able to simplify itself down to this, and people might start using it...
Do you have any idea what the hell we have been talking about? Or are you another self-entitled person who simply doesn't care?
Well, he got a point : Wowmatrix is easy to use.
It scan you addon folder and you just have to push a button. No java, no .NET, no keyboard short cut to remember.
It s easy to see why it looks better for the average user.
Well, he got a point : Wowmatrix is easy to use.
It scan you addon folder and you just have to push a button. No java, no .NET, no keyboard short cut to remember.
It s easy to see why it looks better for the average user.
I'm just trying to understand, if he actually read what we were saying, why he even felt the need to make that post at all. Other than giving us the finger.
The main point is this: When using WoWMatrix, you're not "pirating" addons - you're helping to shut down the very addon distribution sites WoWMatrix steals bandwidth from...by helping them to steal the bandwidth and drive up their expenses. You're also pissing many addon authors off...but I suppose that goes with the "pirating" mentality.
Do you have any idea what the hell we have been talking about? Or are you another self-entitled person who simply doesn't care?
I know that the philosofy of wowmatrix is genuine wrong, and my post maybe derailed this thread, but no Im not a non caring person.
My point is and was as simple as : The problem with wowmatrix is that it works, its simple and does nothing more than what you whant a updater to do. This makes its much easier for the abyss of addon-users to use this instead of an manager that wont read your addon folder, wont show you version numbers, wont allow you to update without externals, and simply is to clumsy and feels like a 10 mile step into the past. CC actually makes people go back to manually updateing their addons, and that says alot..
If CC was made user friendly, wowmatrix wouldnt exist. At least not in the highly increasing rate it has now...
In the meantime Im reading these forums everyday, hoping my addons wont crash until CC is improved, and crossing fingers that I dont have to use wowmatrix to able to survive the impending patchday.
I know that the philosofy of wowmatrix is genuine wrong, and my post maybe derailed this thread, but no Im not a non caring person.
My point is and was as simple as : The problem with wowmatrix is that it works, its simple and does nothing more than what you whant a updater to do. This makes its much easier for the abyss of addon-users to use this instead of an manager that wont read your addon folder, wont show you version numbers, wont allow you to update without externals, and simply is to clumsy and feels like a 10 mile step into the past. CC actually makes people go back to manually updateing their addons, and that says alot..
If CC was made user friendly, wowmatrix wouldnt exist. At least not in the highly increasing rate it has now...
In the meantime Im reading these forums everyday, hoping my addons wont crash until CC is improved, and crossing fingers that I dont have to use wowmatrix to able to survive the impending patchday.
Point to remember about CC:
IT IS BETA SOFTWARE!!!
Have I made this point loud and clear? Or do I have to put into a large font size with a blink tag?
Seriously, use the CC software and give usable feedback. Did you find a bug? How is it NOT user friendly. The only way CC will be improved is if users use the software and then give USEABLE feedback. "It sucks" does not cut the mustard.
One thing to remember, defending WoWMatrix on any of the major UI sites (Curse, WoWI, WoWUI) is like begging to be tarred and feathered. Most AddOn authors that know of the program do not like this updater, as does the people who put a lot of money into running the UI sites. A few weeks ago, Kaelten stated that WoWAce would easily move 40 terabytes a month on a normal month. I would imagine that Curse/WoWI/WoWUI's bandwidth usage is similar. Somebody has to pay for all that bandwidth. On the big UI sites, a lot of that bandwidth is paid for by advertising or by users purchasing Premium accounts. WoWMatrix leeches those site's bandwidth, in effect leeching money from those sites as it circumvents those sites' banner ads.
It wouldn't be so bad if the user had to manually add the mod's listing into the updater (the way many multi-site updaters work) AND if WoWMatrix did not have ads of its own. Yes, WoWMatrix is making money while it leeches money from the AddOns sites it pulls from!!!
WoWMatrix = Parasite
Now if you want to continue to defend or make excuses for WoWMatrix, then go ahead. I will get the tar heated up. Now if you will excuse me, I have some chickens to pluck.
I understand that people here and at other UI sites are wary of WoWMatrix, and from what I've read rightly so. But jumping on people who say that is *is* well-designed (from a usability point of view) and who basically just suggest that this is how CC would ideally look like - that is just silly. I would understand it to a degree if johtro had actively defended its modus operandi, but he even wrote explicitly that he doesn't like what they're doing. Yet you threaten to tar and feather him... dear lord.
For the record, I never heard about WoWMatrix before the subject was raised at WoWI, I haven't used it and I don't intend to - jwowupdater does everything I want just fine.
61. Re: Wowmatrix: What's it really doing? 10/08/2008 07:12:59 AM GMT+08:00
Thought experiment time:
1) I go to various sites and download some mods
2) I bookmark the download links for said mods
3) Whenever I want to update my mods, I load up all the bookmarks, and download the files
4) I extract the files into my world of warcraft folder
This is fine.
Replace steps 2 and 3:
2) I write the list of urls in a file
3) Instead of using my web browser, I write a shell script with wget to open all the links in the file
Is this still fine?
Now I add a bit to the script to do step #4 automatically.
Is this still fine?
At this point, there are only two differences between my utility and WoWMatrix: 1) I don't see any ads during the process, from the download sites or otherwise. 2) I had to manually create the list.
Are those two points really what people here are sticking on?
Notwithstanding the court decision Maul quoted, is there really anything fundamentally wrong with this arrangement?
I don't have any strong opinions one way or the other about WoWMatrix, but I really don't understand where people are coming from...
I share Cogwheel's view. It is just an updater. Like any other. Like JWU or WUU. Everyone is just objecting to the ad profits, it becomes a discussion of MORALS as opposed to LEGALITY.
there is a big difference. If cog started to distribute that script to others, it would still be ok. There are many multi-site updaters out there, even a few script based updaters as well.
But the line is drawn when those scripts / programs start throwing up a pop-up with an independent ads, and the author of that script starts to get $$ from the script getting used, Then you become no better than wowmatrix people.
the CurseClient on the other hand has that right to put adds in and charge for it as it is the sanctioned client of curse, no other updater has that right. It's not the legality of it all, it is the ethics.
But the line is drawn when those scripts start throwing up a pop-up with an independent ads, and the author of that script starts to get $$ from the script getting used, Then you become no better than wowmatrix people.
I repeat: It becomes a discussion of MORALS (and ETHICS) as opposed to LEGALITY.
Because it is perfectly legal for me to distribute a script that makes money for me.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Does anyone know of a better updater than wow matrix, or is it the best one out there?
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
Curse PremiumYou may want to do a search on the forum about wowmatrix
If wow matrix updates my mods i don't really care if the dev doesn't take the steps to protect their content. We are talking about free mods that require 3rd party sites to get their name out there. If the devs are really that pissed that wowmatrix is profiting off them why don't the devs sell the mods themselves and stop making it for free?
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
Project AuthorI'm sincerely wondering what reality you're from.
The UI sites host the addons, and give the authors the tools required to update them and interact with their users on bug reports. WoWMatrix strips the authors of these abilities, and in fact completely hides the fact that there ARE authors at all. Beyond that, instead of downloading the addon and hosting it themselves, whenever a WoWMatrix user updates their addons, the client pulls directly from the host site - stealing that site's bandwidth and costing them money.
Also: It's rather hard to sell open-source code since it's OPEN. What you sell is support, or accept donations. Otherwise you obfuscate the code making it hard (but not impossible) to read and duplicate.
It sounds to me like you don't give two shits about the hours on end the authors put into their work. You just want it handed to you and you want it to work and if it doesn't, fuck everyone. Please, go away.
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
Curse PremiumThis.
I hope you don't use any of my mods, and if you do, I ask that you stop using them. My addons might be free to use, but they did cost me time and effort to think of, write, debug and publish to some site that wowmatrix scraped for their data. I would hope that users would appreciate that and not use sleazy tools like wowmatrix.
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
Curse PremiumPlease go away.
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
Curse PremiumWish CC would be able to simplify itself down to this, and people might start using it...
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
Project AuthorDo you have any idea what the hell we have been talking about? Or are you another self-entitled person who simply doesn't care?
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
Curse PremiumIt scan you addon folder and you just have to push a button. No java, no .NET, no keyboard short cut to remember.
It s easy to see why it looks better for the average user.
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
Project AuthorI'm just trying to understand, if he actually read what we were saying, why he even felt the need to make that post at all. Other than giving us the finger.
The main point is this: When using WoWMatrix, you're not "pirating" addons - you're helping to shut down the very addon distribution sites WoWMatrix steals bandwidth from...by helping them to steal the bandwidth and drive up their expenses. You're also pissing many addon authors off...but I suppose that goes with the "pirating" mentality.
I know that the philosofy of wowmatrix is genuine wrong, and my post maybe derailed this thread, but no Im not a non caring person.
My point is and was as simple as : The problem with wowmatrix is that it works, its simple and does nothing more than what you whant a updater to do. This makes its much easier for the abyss of addon-users to use this instead of an manager that wont read your addon folder, wont show you version numbers, wont allow you to update without externals, and simply is to clumsy and feels like a 10 mile step into the past. CC actually makes people go back to manually updateing their addons, and that says alot..
If CC was made user friendly, wowmatrix wouldnt exist. At least not in the highly increasing rate it has now...
In the meantime Im reading these forums everyday, hoping my addons wont crash until CC is improved, and crossing fingers that I dont have to use wowmatrix to able to survive the impending patchday.
Point to remember about CC:
IT IS BETA SOFTWARE!!!
Have I made this point loud and clear? Or do I have to put into a large font size with a blink tag?
Seriously, use the CC software and give usable feedback. Did you find a bug? How is it NOT user friendly. The only way CC will be improved is if users use the software and then give USEABLE feedback. "It sucks" does not cut the mustard.
One thing to remember, defending WoWMatrix on any of the major UI sites (Curse, WoWI, WoWUI) is like begging to be tarred and feathered. Most AddOn authors that know of the program do not like this updater, as does the people who put a lot of money into running the UI sites. A few weeks ago, Kaelten stated that WoWAce would easily move 40 terabytes a month on a normal month. I would imagine that Curse/WoWI/WoWUI's bandwidth usage is similar. Somebody has to pay for all that bandwidth. On the big UI sites, a lot of that bandwidth is paid for by advertising or by users purchasing Premium accounts. WoWMatrix leeches those site's bandwidth, in effect leeching money from those sites as it circumvents those sites' banner ads.
It wouldn't be so bad if the user had to manually add the mod's listing into the updater (the way many multi-site updaters work) AND if WoWMatrix did not have ads of its own. Yes, WoWMatrix is making money while it leeches money from the AddOns sites it pulls from!!!
WoWMatrix = Parasite
Now if you want to continue to defend or make excuses for WoWMatrix, then go ahead. I will get the tar heated up. Now if you will excuse me, I have some chickens to pluck.
For the record, I never heard about WoWMatrix before the subject was raised at WoWI, I haven't used it and I don't intend to - jwowupdater does everything I want just fine.
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
Curse PremiumPost #61 by Cogwheel
I share Cogwheel's view. It is just an updater. Like any other. Like JWU or WUU. Everyone is just objecting to the ad profits, it becomes a discussion of MORALS as opposed to LEGALITY.
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
Curse Premiumthere is a big difference. If cog started to distribute that script to others, it would still be ok. There are many multi-site updaters out there, even a few script based updaters as well.
But the line is drawn when those scripts / programs start throwing up a pop-up with an independent ads, and the author of that script starts to get $$ from the script getting used, Then you become no better than wowmatrix people.
the CurseClient on the other hand has that right to put adds in and charge for it as it is the sanctioned client of curse, no other updater has that right. It's not the legality of it all, it is the ethics.
-
View User Profile
-
View Posts
-
Send Message
Curse PremiumI repeat: It becomes a discussion of MORALS (and ETHICS) as opposed to LEGALITY.
Because it is perfectly legal for me to distribute a script that makes money for me.