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    posted a message on LibAutoAlts-1.0
    Forgot... following http://www.wowace.com/addons/libautoalts/ give you a nice result:

    We're sorry, you've attempted to access a page that you're not allowed to access.

    If you find this to be in error, please notify the administrators.
    Posted in: Libraries
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    posted a message on LibAutoAlts-1.0

    wonderful idea indeed. I really don't know if it's best to have an addon, a faceless addon or a library. Maybe a full flagged addon could be best, provided that it could help in fixing the bad alt's notes.

    As is: showing the alts that doesn't have the right guild note, the "zombies" (alts of mains that left the guild, or changed their names) and such.

    On the other hand I find having a full-flagged addon would probably delay it.

    BTW, I borrowed some ideas from Chatter and I wrote a rough DoGuildInspection() function. I didn't test it tho, beside running the code snippet in wowlua (and it works).

    Anyway, I posted it here: http://paste.wowace.com/1946/


    Posted in: Libraries
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    posted a message on CastYeller2 - official thread
    There's a simple (yet elegant imho) solution: add a prefix to the message.
    "Innervating $TARGET. Enjoy !" -- all outputs
    "WHISPER:Innervating $TARGET. Enjoy !" -- just Whisper module
    "BROADCAST|CUSTOM_CHAN:Innervating $TARGET. Enjoy !" -- Broadcast channel and Custom Channel modules

    ...and so on.

    It would not add further complexity to the configuration UI and to the output modules either, it's just a matter of checking if there's a specific token in front of the message.

    Posted in: General AddOns
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    posted a message on CastYeller2 - official thread
    terrific mod, a great improvement over old castyeller. Thanks. However I have a small question:

    is it possible to define different custom announces for different outputs ?

    I mean, in old castyeller it was possible to define two different random sets of tells for whispers and channels. Is it possible with CastYeller2 ? Haven't found anything about that (maybe I'm blind).

    Posted in: General AddOns
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    posted a message on Skinner
    Hi, quick report on Skinner's "strange results" on some addons:

    sRaidFrames: Skinner overwrites the background coloring of raid frames. As a result you can't see the color of applied debuff (and you can't dispell 'em).

    epgp: subframes are misplaced. Commenting out the line:
    "if i == 1 then Skinner:moveObject(v, nil, nil, "+", 20) end"
    solves the issue. However I'm not totally good with this solution, as there is a huge unused space at the top of the frame.

    AdvancedTradeSkillWindow: misplaced "buy reagents" frame when you want to buy reagents from vendor with confirmation.

    Not directly related to any skin, fur the "sell junk" button added from FuBar_GarbageFu is misplaced (too much high and right). Maybe it's related to the vendor window skinning.

    Posted in: General AddOns
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    posted a message on Open letter to Curse, or how Curse is considering its "customers":
    Quote from Zikko
    You are saying that the barbarians should rather fight for the king who gives them nothing in return because the "cheap jewelery" isn't enough payment?

    Wow, that's an argument. Curse develops a whole platform (Curseforge) including a ticketing system, SVN, Git and Hg access to it and are even giving back something in return for the addons! You should realize that most of the addon developers make that in their spare time for fun and pleasure, not for profit. Curse in turn gives them Curseforge and a place to upload their mod so they don't have to worry about webspace for it...

    I don't say "Don't release to WoWInterface", but you should realize if you upload something to WoWInterface or WorldOfWar you are doing the same thing: uploading something for a "evil" company to "exploit"...

    I know I know, I shouldn't feed the troll... :(

    Good point indeed. Totally worth an answer.

    First a question tho. How many multi-developer addons are around? Not many. Beside the ACE libraries I see only a very few. Beside the translators tbh I don't really see this huge need for svn or similar stuff. And tbh setting up svn/git/hg servers is a matter of minutes. Anyone could do that with minimum skill requirements. Managing them for a large number of authors is ofc a different thing, but for personal purposes... a matter of minutes.

    So, there's no real, dramatic need of CurseForge. It's useful, but not required. If you really need there's SurceForge or similar out of here anyway.

    About the distribution system... I never said that Curse is evil and other web sites are angels. They all offer a service and you're free to choose what you like most. What I complained about (maybe) is that authors found themselves in Curse when they had chosen a completely different system.

    What I *am* complaining about is the lack of features and feedbacks from Curse (whereas the WoWAce was totally different). They failed badly our expectations, and when we complained, they didn't show any real respect for the critics. As I said to Adirelle, maybe they're caring, but for sure they're very good at hiding it.

    What I will always complain about (if they don't change it) is that the Author's rewards are a joke. A real "thanks" would be far more satisfactory. Those rewards are like... if I'd was an author posting there I'd feel insulted. You might say "better than nothing", but for me... yes, nothing would had been better. And tbh from the comments I got (other sources) I'm not the only one thinking so.
    Posted in: General Chat
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    posted a message on Open letter to Curse, or how Curse is considering its "customers":
    Quote from syrupk
    I'm not as invested in letting people know how I feel about Curse as you are, I let Moonwitch and a few others know the other day. However, simply enough, this is what needed to happen to the WAU. Curse was their only option. I solved my problem of not liking curse by downloading from this site only and not even installing the Curse client.

    That's one of the points I raised and I'm not going to raise it again. This site is still offering direct downloads. How much time will be needed 'til someone realize that they could do a simple script to check new releases and download them? The bandwidth will not go down... the bandwidth would NOT go down unless they stopped all the "clever" ways to update stuff from here. However from my personal experience there's always someone clever enough (or dumb enough) to do the right/wrong thing. How much time will be needed 'til WoWmatrix (for example) start downloading from here? A week? Two? In the meantime the "good" users will miss features. It's like in the so-called security programs. Normal ppl are affected and burglars are unaffected. Btw... you just gave me an idea. /grab scripting manual /grab SQLite manual /start coding

    Quote from syrupk
    There are ways around using the curse client at all if you don't want to. One of the things that makes me happiest about the merge is that they aren't forcing us to do anything. If you want to autoupdate all your addons, you are going to have to pay for the curse client. I only update one at a time, so I don't need to do that.

    I'm happy for you, but trust me when I say that you're not like the most of the users. Either WAU would had been here still. You're right, they're not forcing. But their kindly suggestions are very convincing. Like the ones of the drugs sellers in front of the schools. The latter are more dangerous and, tbh illegal too. Fortunately.
    Posted in: General Chat
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    posted a message on Open letter to Curse, or how Curse is considering its "customers":
    Quote from OrionShock
    .. eh Constitutional rights do no extend to a privately run forum system, despite it being free registration to post. It is owned by a private company and they have the right to do with it as they please, irregardless of what might be perceived as a constitutional right. As those ideas exclusively apply to government funded and sanctioned operations.

    I know, but sometimes non-USA ppl see the USA as the land of Freedom of Speech. Where everyone have it so hardcoded in their DNA that it's like a profanity to negate it, no matter where you are. Maybe it's a naif idea, but I'm still surprised that anyone could delete any post depending on if it contains critics or other stuff (beside being obscene, offensive or violating laws).

    So, when I saw mine deleted I said "WTF" (not the WoW folder) as it wasn't obscene, I didn't send to the hell anyone (not anyone with names and surnames) and I didn't suggest to use any illegal stuff. Practically speaking it didn't violate any of the forums rules.

    Posted in: General Chat
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    posted a message on Open letter to Curse, or how Curse is considering its "customers":
    Quote from Adirelle
    Arzach, it seems are now pretty angry and embittered. Most people wouldn't give credit to whatever you say because of this. I think you should now refrain from posting for a few moments, calm down and clear your mind.

    Thanks for your suggestion Adirelle, but I can grant you that I'm perfectly calm. I'm used to write my utterly long posts in separate editors, spellcheck 'em and re-read 'em after a quarter to be sure I didn't write something wrong or too harsh (and I can still be very harsh).

    I don't care if you don't trust what I said, but it happened. And despite my quite rough words, I only express facts. Facts are that CC is years behind WAU, the transition generated a number of issues that project leaders didn't forecast (or they simply ignored) and that a lot of users are complaining. And last but not least Curse isn't running any successful customer care policy (it seems that they're doing the opposite).

    Maybe you're looking at this from inside and you have a different view, but I'm reporting what it's seen from our perspective. Lack of communication is the kindest thing I could say. The harshest is ... I'll refrain to express it, it could be too harsh indeed. But you might know who I'm referring to.

    Anyway... as I said g'bye Curse, I had enough of it. I'm back the anonymous leecher status. They had enough time to correct themselves and they lost the train. Interesting enough they're loosing the trust of WoW users too, from what I've seen in WoW official forums...

    Posted in: General Chat
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    posted a message on Open letter to Curse, or how Curse is considering its "customers":
    Quote from Xinhuan
    I have not seen any wowace admins delete any post (from these wowace forums), Arzach. Even the harsh and nasty ones.


    Check also my name, my posts and you'll find one that is "missing in action". Deleted.

    Mmm... now that I think of it. Maybe 'twas because in the message there was also an howto about how to block curse advertisements ? Like if web users wouldn't be smart enough to know how to do it... if this is the case, I'd laugh on them even more.

    BTW, if you're not an admin, I doubt you can see a deleted post if the poster doesn't start yelling like me.
    Posted in: General Chat
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    posted a message on Open letter to Curse, or how Curse is considering its "customers":
    Well, it all started with WoWAce migration to Curse.com. I'll not go into the details of why this migration has been decided and what this will men to authors and addons users, however from the very beginning I didn't miss any chance to raise my critics about it.

    I know I've used harsh words, but you can trust me when I say I never insulted anyone. Well, not in a direct way ofc. The worst thing I wrote was about some drunk monkeys dev team, and the fact that in a normal situation the project leader would had been fired.

    Anyway, my issues with the so called "migration" was (and is) about how was managed. Let me summarize for those not into the tech details:

    Ace used a very efficient revisions and updating system, and its behavior (protocol, revisioning, etc.) was public. We had beautiful open-source updaters, and they were reliable.

    Curse Client (CC from now on) is a closed-source project, its behavior is faulty in a number of ways and its insights are at least questionable. It installs addons without giving feedback, it doesn't support a smooth migration from the old system, there isn't a log (there is for real, but users can't access it easily), and so on. In short, it's a software very far from being reliable. It's not just my opinion, everyone is complaining and the number of open bug tickets is still huge.

    You could say that this isn't a big issue, every software project have its developing phase. Problem is the "migration" started with the CC in this development stage. Hence I went rampage (and not only me tbh) because with the incoming patch we needed a reliable updating system, not something buggy. Btw, the Curse web site is far from perfect as well, because the "migration" populated it with doubled projects, outdated addons marked as new, and so on. You have to be extra careful and know what you're doing, since the "latest update" date is completely wrong for all the migrated addons. Stuff made for WoW 2.0 and never updated is marked as brand new.

    So, I raised a lot of complains, mainly about how the "migration" was managed, and how the whole thing was being lead by project leaders. No clear timelines, no feedbacks to our issues and so on. Just the usual stuff like "we're working for you", "we'll fix sometimes" and so on.

    Anyway, this is what's going on. So, why am I cross-posting this open letter?

    Simple: because Curse is also deleting the posts that are more "harmful" from their forums. Nice isn't it? Freedom of Speech to its best (see USA Constitution). And they're deleting them without giving notices.

    Problem is: WoW Ace was a community, free and open. Curse is a company and the ones using their services are... users. They even have a "Premium" service, that will be not free of charge (price are not yet known) sometime in the near future. The users doesn't know yet what services will remain free and what will have to be paid, and tbh the actual behavior seems exactly like a customer fidelization program before going live with paid services.

    Considering that WoW Ace hosted the most used and widespread addons, this "migration" is resulting in a number of top-hits addons distributed only by Curse, as is a company that will make profit out of them. Again, the problem is that Curse is acting as a non-profit organization when they are not, and the users are not considered as customers, like they should be.

    Hence, since my posts are mostly deleted from their forums, I have no choice other than cross-post in independent forums. Maybe they'll realize that there is a shift in the relationships now. We're no more leechers, we're the ones that will (maybe) pay.

    For the present, I'd suggest to the users to not use Curse Client until its development is finished, as is when:
    1) it will have decent logging features
    2) it will be able to clean your addons folder
    3) it will be smart enough to download the dependancies (e.g. libraries)
    4) it will not install Curse Client addon in your folder silently
    5) it will not upload data gathered by the Curse Client addon to Curse without notice
    6) it will remember its setup
    7) it will not try to substitute your addons with the ones in the Curse repositories (e.g., when you manually download stuff from WoWUI or other web sites)
    8) it will not have a changelog itself. A new relase has been sent out today as far as I know, but there's not changelog. It can be downloaded from their "normal" client download page but there's no MacOS version yet, even if there IS a MacOS version around. And there's no update on the supposedly working CurseForge project page, as is where the project ase supposed to be managed. Again, poor project management.

    And for the authors... Curse program to "feed the authors" is like giving cheap jewelry to the barbarians. Curse is making money out of author's work. It's legal and they're offering a service to the authors, but consider carefully if the benefit you get are compared to the benefits you GIVE to Curse before choosing them.

    As for myself... since they've been so kind to me I'm going to cancel my Curse account and I'll just use them as a web site, when and if I'll need them. Of course blocking their advertisements since they make the web site too slow.


    Cross-posted to: Curse forums, WoW Ace forums, WoW-EU forums. More to come.
    Posted in: General Chat
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    posted a message on The New Curse Client
    Ok, this will my last post here. Last post ever I hope.

    From what I got here is the point: Curse Client is far from decent and you pushed it into stage because patch was incoming and "old" WoWAce couldn't resist another patch updating week of madness.

    Sorry, but this doesn't make me feel better. On the contrary. It makes me feel even more sad. To prevent issues on servers you gave to the uses a thing that is and will cause more problems than it can solve. Tbh this is even worse than anything I could imagine.

    I really feel sad for you guys and girls. And to answer your replies: yes, I know about the "hidden" MacOS version, but that's NOT the only point. That was only a minor point to point out that the transition was made in a timely hellish time. Hellish for us ofc, not for you.

    And about the idea that Kaelten (or any of those that lead this "thing") is caring about the users... sorry but I can't really even slightly trust this idea.

    You had a lot of options to avoid all this and you didn't. You even KNEW that the CC thing was still missing fundamental things. And you went ahead. No. I don't trust your kindness anymore.

    I'll do it (maybe) when you'll start loosing your "coolness" (that to my eyes is just "I don't care") and you'll admit what you've done. Start from scratch, with humility and look at what should be the minimum things needed by an updater. You had WAU under your eyes for quite some time, isn't it ? Learn from it and from other updaters.

    Tbh I feel like when Microsoft come out with a "new" OS and then sends out like 500MB of "security updates" after a week. Just because they had to keep up with the release date. Sad, incredibly sad. And angry.

    Anyway, I'll shut up myself. You did a mess, and that's just to be polite. You have to understand this before you can improve. Having done WoWAce in the past doesn't mean you're always good. And promising beautiful things in the future at the expense of "some" problems now... you're no more what you was. You're ready to be a politician. Only them are allowed by contract to fool ppl around.

    We had something that worked flawlessly. We could had done with something temporary (a "download only" web site? A number of torrents?). We can't accept something that's way less what we had. CC isn't even close to what we had. Shiny maybe, but still a piece of shiny junk. Fix it, fix it BEFORE the patch and maybe you'll gain what you lost.

    PS: to those that are trying to be fun with ppl that express their feelings: you'd better [fill with something good for you]. If ppl have complaints, you'd better listen to them. I feel so tired of all this... g'bye ppl. You could had started all this in a different way instead of trying to "being cool" and act exactly like a dork would do. "if everything around you falls and you keep calm, either you're a saint or you didn't got what's happening". I guess you fall in the 2nd category.
    Posted in: Updaters
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    posted a message on The New Curse Client
    Quote from justcallmefred
    Kaelton, on a personal note, may I ask what higher karma do you look up too? calm and kool....boy don't I wish I could be like that! :)

    It's easy... just repeat yourself: "I don't give a sh*t about what they think. I don't give a sh*t about what they're writing. I'm now an employee with a guaranteed salary at the end of the month and that's the important stuff".

    Easy, isn't it ?
    Posted in: Updaters
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    posted a message on The New Curse Client
    Quote from Kaelten
    We fully admit that there is more work to do with the CC. I've never denied that.

    And actually the release strategy on the new site IS a major step forward.

    Doing what we where doing before was BAD, VERY BAD. No its not as easy, and no its not as painless.

    These changes overall, had to happen, and in the end we'll all be better for it.

    Also the beta link is freely available. It's listed in multiple places in the announcement on the front page.

    I'll reply point by point, trying to be calm (it's a very hard task):

    1) if you don't deny the CC have more work to do before it's ready, it shouldn't had been released, simple. The client is what ppl is relying onto for updating. It's screwing things.

    2) the release strategy is a success only from the point of forcing ppl to use curse even if they didn't want. Other than that it's a total failure. Go see the comments in every forum.

    3) what you did before was bad because you think it was bad. It's a matter of management. If you think it was bad, you're automatically admitting your management wasn't right.

    4) the changes had to happen. I totally agree. What everyone is complaining about is HOW the change have been done.

    5) the CC beta was freely available only for Windows users. MacOS users are still in the middle of nowhere. Sure, it's "under development" but it's not public.

    So, to be clean, polite and short: the migration was and is a total failure from the perspective of:
    1) management
    2) development

    You got it clear now ?
    Posted in: Updaters
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    posted a message on The New Curse Client
    Quote from Laibcoms
    Eh, finally, people seeing the light :p

    #1: If you started playing WoW WITH AddOns, Im not surprised that you are doomed;
    #2: If you started using AddOns by using updaters, Im definitely not surprised that you are doomed;

    You choose:
    A) Download manually each ADDON (NOT Library - but who can stop you from download manually each lib) and get to play WoW like that way you are playing it now, especially on patch day - Oct 14; or
    B) Go rely on updaters and don't give feedback that will help it improve, and stop playing WoW because not one of your important addons works for 3.0.2?

    The answer is simple and obvious.

    I see the light too. The light of the train that should soon hit you just 1% of all if my curses could reach you.


    Should I loose 1h of my time and a lot of swearing 'cuz the developer team "forgot" to add what was a *BASIC* feature of WAU, aka the nolib ?

    Should I loose 1h of my time and a lot of swearing 'cuz the Curse web site can't recognize things by release date ? The Ace system added a r[0-9]* date automatically. What's the issue with that ? Too complex ? We're back to every author naming their releases as they want ? BIG STEP AHEAD, BRILLIANT.

    And all this sh*t after MONTHS of beta testing and CC development. Moreover the "infamous" MacOS version is nowhere publicly available, we should "kindly ask" the dev team for a preview copy.

    See the light ? I have mercy of you all, that need by contract to defend an idiotic and devastating decision. Still I curse you and whoever agreed to this.

    We had a system that allowed to click, see the changes, update. WHY change ? Because the costs was too high ? FINE, but you forgot the PRIMARY rule.

    The new system have to WORK before the change. You're working for Microsoft ? Only them are used to do this kind of crap. CC is simply NOT OPERATIVE.

    Admit that and maybe you'll be able to recover from what has been a total failure.
    Posted in: Updaters
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